I had a pretty weird thing happen today that I wanted to share with everyone. My wife was complaining of a sulfur/rotten egg smell in the garage. We checked everything in the garage but could not find the source until I checked the battery compartments in the boat. The starter battery was extremely hot as well as the trolling motor batteries. After unplugging the 3 bank charger and pulling the starter battery the smell is gone. It took a few hrs for the battery to cool down but I'm unsure if the optima is still usable. I think the starter battery was pretty close to exploding. I usually just leave the charger on trickle charging, but now I think I will charge it up after fishing and pull the charger off until the night before the next trip. I think this could have been really bad if we weren't quick to figure out the problem. So it looks like I need a 3 bank charger if anyone has one. Not sure of the battery status but these optimal were 4 yrs old so probably will replace them anyway.
Not often you hear of the charger going bad effecting all battery banks. Usually it's one of three, for example or more often than not it's a shorted cell in the battery. Just curious, what brand/model charger did you have? Good thing you got to it before bad things happened!
I leave my Dual Pro charger plugged in all the time. Have been doing that since the boat was new in 07. Defiantly something to think about though.
--here ya go--
it's like new--
reply
Posted: 3 months ago
Pro Mariner tournament 150 battery charger - $275 (s.chandler)
Paid over $400---3 step battery charger, 12v,24v,36v--
ProTournament 150* 51015 12/24/36 15 3 150 amps / 10hrs 6'/6'/6' 3"x 13" x 6 7/8" 8 lbs 90-135
e mail or call 602-430-0166---the $275 is VERY FIRM !!!--like new--
Guys, I have designed and manufactured battery chargers and power sources for a long time. I don't care what brand name is on the label, DON'T LEAVE ANY OF THEM PLUGGED IN any longer than it takes to charge the batteries up. Trickle is nice but they are microprocessor controlled. Average life of a micro is 5 yrs. When they fail, they USUALLY fail safely but why gamble? We had a batch that we sold to Radio Shack that failed 'closed' rather than 'open' and the company that I worked for paid out over $100K of damages in 24 months.
The micro in Brian's should have detected the shorted cell but many of them do not perform all of the safety checks when they switch to trickle.
The house that you burn down may be your own.
It is the cabellas brand charger. I have always left them plugged in, not anymore!
Thanks for the reminder.
Yeah the first week I had my 15 amp 3 bank MinnKota expensive charger I put I'm guessing an Old red Optima on there. Battery was boiling the next morning and hissing - glad it didn't explode. Now I have 15 amp circuit breaker and I think I recall 15 amp fuses on the lines and it didn't blow so was probably just cranking somewhere under 15 amps all night. I figured it was the unique differences of the optima as the other non-optima batteries charged fine. And I got a new non-optima connected to same one the optima was on and no boiling works fine.
Quote from: sandman on March 06, 2014, 07:24 PM
Guys, I have designed and manufactured battery chargers and power sources for a long time. I don't care what brand name is on the label, DON'T LEAVE ANY OF THEM PLUGGED IN any longer than it takes to charge the batteries up. Trickle is nice but they are microprocessor controlled. Average life of a micro is 5 yrs. When they fail, they USUALLY fail safely but why gamble? We had a batch that we sold to Radio Shack that failed 'closed' rather than 'open' and the company that I worked for paid out over $100K of damages in 24 months.
The micro in Brian's should have detected the shorted cell but many of them do not perform all of the safety checks when they switch to trickle.
The house that you burn down may be your own.
Dang....that's different than what the manufacturers claim. I've got a NOCO Genius....its a charger that they claim will detect bad cells etc. I'm guessing relying on that will ultimately end with having an issue. It really doesn't matter how long it works perfectly.....it's that one time it fails that really matters. I'll follow Sandman's advice from here on.
All of the 'smart' chargers will detect bad cells, when they are working properly. Great technology but it is just that, technology.
There are lots of things that we all take for granted and leave plugged in 24/7. That all changed for me about 15-20 yrs ago when I started working very closely with the electronics manufacturers in Asia and Eastern Europe. Now, we unplug a lot of stuff when we are not using it. Especially stuff that has a heating element and/or thermal limiter of some sort in it. I also have things that I only operate on a brick isolated from anything flammable. One of those things is battery chargers.
Most all products used to be UL tested and that meant something. UL is a private organization ( I always thought it was gov't) and it is not what it used to be. Look for at a minimum UL Listed. That means that it has been tested and the production process is monitored by UL. UL recognized is not the same. Assembled with UL components is not the same.
Many manufacturers have chosen cheaper certifications and those often have less controls on the manufacturing process and source control of the parts inside products.
Just something to think about.
Quote from: sandman on March 07, 2014, 05:07 AM
All of the 'smart' chargers will detect bad cells, when they are working properly. Great technology but it is just that, technology.
There are lots of things that we all take for granted and leave plugged in 24/7. That all changed for me about 15-20 yrs ago when I started working very closely with the electronics manufacturers in Asia and Eastern Europe. Now, we unplug a lot of stuff when we are not using it. Especially stuff that has a heating element and/or thermal limiter of some sort in it. I also have things that I only operate on a brick isolated from anything flammable. One of those things is battery chargers.
Most all products used to be UL tested and that meant something. UL is a private organization ( I always thought it was gov't) and it is not what it used to be. Look for at a minimum UL Listed. That means that it has been tested and the production process is monitored by UL. UL recognized is not the same. Assembled with UL components is not the same.
Many manufacturers have chosen cheaper certifications and those often have less controls on the manufacturing process and source control of the parts inside products.
Just something to think about.
agreed, went on a lot of fires through the years that you would be surprised what caused them, something what seems so safe malfunctions and then there are problems, I always shut down chargers in the boat and even electronics etc. in the house when not in use or if I am going to be gone for extended times, heck sometimes brown outs or reset of electric company power can create problems, better safe than sorry. I have had batteries with a weak or shorted cell and the charger detects that it is just undercharged and fry a battery with the water completely gone out of a battery when left on.
thx for the info guys. ya learn something everyday. I usually wont recharge until the night before the next trip. my three bank that only is hooked up to the two trolling batts has a sequence of light flashes that I don't understand for a bad batt.
Quote from: menrats on March 07, 2014, 06:39 AM
thx for the info guys. ya learn something everyday. I usually wont recharge until the night before the next trip. my three bank that only is hooked up to the two trolling batts has a sequence of light flashes that I don't understand for a bad batt.
Yes +1 on the info.
Hey Tom,
I do the same as you but I try to get the 3 bank plugged in as soon as I get home from the lake, let them charge about 24 hours and then leave them unplugged until the night before the next trip, topping them off one more time. I read and heard it's better for the batteries to be kept on the top end of their charge.
I try not to leave it plugged in for long periods of time, gas tank isn't far from the batteries and charger :bom:
Quote from: menrats on March 07, 2014, 06:39 AMI usually won't recharge until the night before the next trip.
I've read, for what it's worth, that it's best to recharge your batteries as soon as you get home from the lake. You don't want your batteries to sit in a discharged state as it'll shorten their life span. Again, that's what I've read so....... :dontknow:
OOpps..... Sorry Shea, didn't mean to duplicate your post!
Quote from: cousinlll on March 07, 2014, 07:33 AM
OOpps….. Sorry Shea, didn't mean to duplicate your post!
:violent1: No Problem! I do think it's the best practice though!
I used to mistreat my batteries on my boat and my tires on my truck, some out of ignorance and some from laziness. Needless to say, I've made some big changes. My current set of both batteries and tires have out-lived all previous, and they seem to be in great condition.
Brian, thanks for the OP, good reminder and info from Kelley as well!
Not that starter batteries get drained much but those style you really want to keep at full charge and limit time at half or below - but doubtful they get that low unless you have other stuff like electronics and bubblers on them. So I would agree charge them once you get home. Deep cycle can handle getting drained better but same think I don't believe you want them sitting in non-fully charged state for too long. Only exception and concern I have with these 15 amp chargers is if they charge too fast. That just heats up the battery and heat is a killer so if you have a slow trickle charge setting if you're not in a rush I'd say use that. I agree now I unplug after a day when all are charged and then I charge the night before.
Same here. Charge when I get home and then top off before a trip. Freezes kill a partially charged battery easier (not a problem here) so it was a habit that I got into long ago.
Quote from: OneBlade on March 07, 2014, 07:44 AM
Not that starter batteries get drained much but those style you really want to keep at full charge and limit time at half or below - but doubtful they get that low unless you have other stuff like electronics and bubblers on them. So I would agree charge them once you get home. Deep cycle can handle getting drained better but same think I don't believe you want them sitting in non-fully charged state for too long. Only exception and concern I have with these 15 amp chargers is if they charge too fast. That just heats up the battery and heat is a killer so if you have a slow trickle charge setting if you're not in a rush I'd say use that. I agree now I unplug after a day when all are charged and then I charge the night before.
some of your outboards like opti max and other computer controlled engines with the slightest reduction in voltage won't start :o they will crank but not start have had several friends run down starting batteries with electronics on and have an outboard not start even when it sounds ok cranking. One nice thing about larger outboards many have high amp alternators so they charge stuff quick with a run down the lake.
Thanks for all the good info here.
Quote from: wadefisherman on March 06, 2014, 07:58 PM
It is the cabellas brand charger. I have always left them plugged in, not anymore!
Brian you may want to check the warranty on your charger , I believe Pro Mariner was making the Cabelas Brand chargers and Pro Mariner Chargers have a 2 year replacement warranty and a limited lifetime repair warranty. which means if it is repairable they fix it free of charge. ..That is if yours is covered.
Also Oneblade mentioned he had once mixed an Optima with 2 regular batteries on his three bank charger. This should never be done , These chargers will work on one or the other but they cant be used for both and most of them require you set them up for either /or on your initial install.
It is about 5 years old, just got a new one at cabellas. I had all blue top optimas and will be replacing with same. I'm thankful it was not a worse situation. Will not leave it on charging more than 24 hrs ever again. I hope the info was useful for everyone.
Brian, not cool at all, but I understand feeling happy with a $1000 lost considering the potential of what could have happened. Thank you to everyone for sharing knowledge on the topic. Being low tech, I charge with a portable charger literally, inches from my 3 gallon portable gas tank. Never again due to everyone sharing their history and knowledge. Great sight, with great quality people posting.
I need to buy a new charger. I have a very old 4 amp trickle charger I have used for years on my cars. The new boat has two separate lead acid batteries and I store it outside. If I charge them overnight, is it ok to leave my harbor freight float charger plugged into them? I think it charges at the micro amp level and is designed to taper off. Really great site and great info on this thread.
-Ed
I would not leave any electronics that I purchased from Harbor Freight plugged in for very long at all. I have a pair of those chargers that I bought for our quads. The have an ETL cert which does not require any more than initial design testing. I used them outdoors laying on my steel trailer for a couple of days. They worked OK.
Charging up your boat batteries before you store the boat is probably all that you need. They shouldn't really discharge while sitting outside unless there's some sort of parasitic drain on them. I use a Perko disconnect. No drain.